At Home Mechanic

On my rant about Targa topped cars Bryce wrote:
"There have been a few Targa topped cars in history that have been pretty good.

The Fiat X1/9 was engineered from the start to be that way, to have an open top while meet safety requirements that never actually materialized. My Lancia Beta Zagato uses a targa top over the front seats and convertible top over the rear seats to meet safety requirements. The targa bar is tied to the windscreen which gives framed windows and a stiffer body structure. The mk1 Zagatos did not have that and were considerably more flexible.

The original Porsche 911 Targas were similar in this regard, the rear window area zipped out and the targa top could be stowed. You ended up again, with a fully open car with a roll bar.

The Honda Del Sol is probably one of the best targa topped cars ever. With the targa top off (and secured in the brilliant pivoting rack in the trunk) and the rear window down, you are driving an open top car with a roll bar. It's quite safe and feels just about as open as my Fiat Spider did. And it feels quite similar to convertibles I've been in with roll bars.

Finally, the Lotus Elise is more or less a targa car, except it has a soft top (a hard top is available, but cannot be stowed in car). Standing next to one with the top off and windows down leads me to believe that the ratio of open to closed is basically that of a convertible. Seeing them driven and seeing the wind blow around the drivers confirms that belief."

ATM replies:

Cars that were originally engineered to be Targa topped vehicles are measurably better than cars that just had their roof sawed off by some guy in a figurative back alley. But the rigidity of an open top car will generally be less than a closed top car.

The other lesson I learned from Bryce is to never mess with the Italian car crowd, they are the most heartfelt car enthusiasts on the planet.

Regarding my mentioning Chyrsler's use of torsion bar suspensions starting in the 1950's Dave Darling writes:
"The torsion bar suspension was patented by Dr. Ferdinand Porsche back in the 30s. (See the earliest VW Bugs for examples.) ChryCo had to wait until the patents ran out to come out with their own versions"

ATM replies:

An interesting bit of trivia that I did not know before. I had always thought that Chrysler adopted the torsion bar suspension from the Sherman tank that they helped mass produce during World WarII.

ATM got two responses about my observation about retro inspired car designs.

Spira writes, "why not design cars with the flare and joy of the 50's and 60's (preserving your woodys...) and equipt them with the techno wizzardry of the 00's..."

And Scott (not me, I swear) responds, "Spira asks a good question. The answer is that the car manufacturers are turning out "retro" inspired cars like the Ford Thunderbird (Cancelled due to poor sales) and the Chrysler PT Cruiser and many others. But modern manufacturing practices (They have to make a profit and can not afford to be as lavish with sheetmetal and chrome as they once were) and modern safety regulations (Airbags, seatbelts, roll over standards, etc,) make it impractical to just build a '56 Chevy with a modern engine management system."

And finally I had to stick in a thumbs up from crxfisher, for my observation about the three phases of any car repair project.
"This is so true! I had to laugh while reading it. That's just exactly how it is."